6-yr old NY Speeding Ticket

Steve said:
I would probably do a quick google search on the municipality where the ticket was issued. There were some problem courts up there and certain judges were removed due to misconduct. The local judges are elected and many are not lawyers and don't really understand the law and get into trouble.

How could a judge not be a lawyer? That's crazy.

You don't have to be a lawyer to be a Justice of the United States Supreme Court, either.

Just pay it or you are gonna end up having to sing in the Boar's Nest for a month.

ffof said:
I'm frightened, Auntie Em.

NYS troopers working the Taconic are power-hungry and out of control. Once was forced by a trooper on the Taconic to abandon my car and take ride with him to a barracks 60 miles in the wrong direction, because I had sped and had a valid license from NJ, while living in NY (accused me of driving without a valid license).

After two hours waiting in the barracks, with zero interaction, without explanation, I was driven 60 miles back to my car. Five hours wasted clearly didn't help my perception of "law enforcement". I doubt I was the only victim of this bizarre local justice.

FWIW, I got a speeding ticket in NY some years ago when attempting to get away from 2 tractor trailers on either side of me.

I was pulled over by an unmarked vehicle and a police officer walked over to me. I said I was driving with traffic and sped up only to get away from being wedged between the the two trucks. He gave me a ticket and I went to court. I was very worried about the points.

I stated my case at the hearing and my PO showed up and offered painstaking details of my wrongdoing. So I had to pay the fine and for good measure, an additional amount for court fees. The judge never even looked at me or anyone else who spoke. What a waste of time.

In the end, I don't remember any mention of the points by my NJ insurance company. If there was any consequence, it was not noticeable.

I was stopped for 85 in a 65 zone near Moreau, NY on the Thruway. The state trooper reduced the offense to 74 in a 65 zone because my record was clean. I paid the fine and, if I was assessed points, I never saw any evidence of it.

I keep reading this title as "6 year old gets speeding ticket"

as soon as I cross into NY, I drive 1mph under the speed limit. As soon as I hit CT or NJ its on like Donkey Kong.

If you haven't sent your letter yet, I would modify JerseyJack's advice just a bit, by not stating that you have no notes, which is an admission that might weaken your case rather than strengthening it.

Tom_Reingold said:
There are a thousand reasons the ticket could be lost for so long. That's not important. If you were not guilty, I think jerseyjack's advice is best. If you were guilty, pay the fine and be done. People try to get out of traffic tickets just because they don't want them, and to me, that's not a good reason. Yes, the system is messed up, but that's not a reason, either, if you were guilty.

When we achieve utopia, and wrongdoers routinely turn themselves in for punishment, I'll go with your suggestion.

On the other hand, if we surrender our civil liberties, any of them, we'll soon have none.

TomR

P.s., and for what it's worth, nobody's guilty until the Judge bangs their gavel.

Tom, nobody is convicted until the judge bangs the gavel. A person is guilty as soon as they commit the crime.

Jasmo said:
If you haven't sent your letter yet, I would modify JerseyJack's advice just a bit, by not stating that you have no notes, which is an admission that might weaken your case rather than strengthening it.

I spoke with the court clerk on the phone. She said she was shocked when the ticket arrived on her computer since it had been 6 years. She still has my plea on file. SHe said there is not any law about statute of limitations. She is going to send me a copy of the ticket which I know has a record of our conversation on it.

I decided I'm not goiing to send a letter. I'm just going to go to the court. and tell them I did my part by sending in the plea as soon as I got the ticket and then say that I just got the summons to court after over 6 years. If they ask me why I think I'm not guilty, I'm going to just say that 6 years is a long time and I don't remember all the details. I'll also tell them I don't have any other infractions on my record.

Frankly I do remember all that surrounded the ticket but I think it will just sound like a 'story' and I think that might not help my case. I'll just stick with the current facts.

Steve said:
You don't have to be a lawyer to be a Justice of the United States Supreme Court, either.

This situation seemed to be...different. I thought maybe they had a magistrate system, then I read this.

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/09/25/nyregion/25courts.html?pagewanted=all

ffof said:

Jasmo said:
If you haven't sent your letter yet, I would modify JerseyJack's advice just a bit, by not stating that you have no notes, which is an admission that might weaken your case rather than strengthening it.

I spoke with the court clerk on the phone. She said she was shocked when the ticket arrived on her computer since it had been 6 years. She still has my plea on file. SHe said there is not any law about statute of limitations. She is going to send me a copy of the ticket which I know has a record of our conversation on it.
I decided I'm not goiing to send a letter. I'm just going to go to the court. and tell them I did my part by sending in the plea as soon as I got the ticket and then say that I just got the summons to court after over 6 years. If they ask me why I think I'm not guilty, I'm going to just say that 6 years is a long time and I don't remember all the details. I'll also tell them I don't have any other infractions on my record.
Frankly I do remember all that surrounded the ticket but I think it will just sound like a 'story' and I think that might not help my case. I'll just stick with the current facts.

See, this is the bull***** that makes me nuts. She is correct in stating that there is no STATUTORY time limit, but there IS a well established limit in case law.

http://www.newyorkcriminalattorneyblog.com/2008/09/constitutional_right_to_a_spee.html

Of course, they know that, but if you don't assert your rights they haven't violated the statute because there is none. They know full well you don't have to pay, but they're going for a money grab and misleading you to do it.

Justice, local yokel style.

Yup.

The chances of me paying anything to them in this situation, let alone schlep to them for the privilege of doingso, are absolutely nil.

Okay, great link. I had been looking for something like that and guess I didn't do the right search. I could send letter with these cases as back up, or just show up anyway with my defense? Both? I guess by sending letter the judge has a chance to dismiss before I even get there.

I guess you have to find a way to file for a dismissal. You could call a lawyer up in that area and have them do it. Or you could google around and see if there is a form you can use.

You might just be able to inform the clerk of your intention to file and contest on speedy trial grounds, but get your ducks in a row. They may break your balls and make you go to a hearing to hear the motion and if that happens I'd call a lawyer from the area.

As far as finding more info- Google "speedy trial traffic ticket New York State" and you'll find plenty. You will not be paying this ticket- it just depends on how miserable they want to make you

So far from google searching, it seems like I can just call the court clerk and say that I would like to file for a dismissal (for lack of speedy trial) and then she can tell me proper way to do that. Or I just show up for hte pre-trial with my supporting info. It's a 2 hour drive to podunk, NY. But it would be nice not to have to go. In the meantime, the county clerk is sending me a copy of the ticket.

I believe The"statute of limitations" issue is moot anyway. That's about charging you with something. Once you were handed the ticket, you were charged. As JF says, it's about a speedy trial.

Jackson_Fusion said:

ffof said:

Jasmo said:
If you haven't sent your letter yet, I would modify JerseyJack's advice just a bit, by not stating that you have no notes, which is an admission that might weaken your case rather than strengthening it.

I spoke with the court clerk on the phone. She said she was shocked when the ticket arrived on her computer since it had been 6 years. She still has my plea on file. SHe said there is not any law about statute of limitations. She is going to send me a copy of the ticket which I know has a record of our conversation on it.
I decided I'm not goiing to send a letter. I'm just going to go to the court. and tell them I did my part by sending in the plea as soon as I got the ticket and then say that I just got the summons to court after over 6 years. If they ask me why I think I'm not guilty, I'm going to just say that 6 years is a long time and I don't remember all the details. I'll also tell them I don't have any other infractions on my record.
Frankly I do remember all that surrounded the ticket but I think it will just sound like a 'story' and I think that might not help my case. I'll just stick with the current facts.

See, this is the bull***** that makes me nuts. She is correct in stating that there is no STATUTORY time limit, but there IS a well established limit in case law.
http://www.newyorkcriminalattorneyblog.com/2008/09/constitutional_right_to_a_spee.html
Of course, they know that, but if you don't assert your rights they haven't violated the statute because there is none. They know full well you don't have to pay, but they're going for a money grab and misleading you to do it.
Justice, local yokel style.

This travesty of justice drives me nuts, too. Yep, local "justice" is often just a racket, in the truest sense of the word. Got a speeding ticket in some one-traffic light town in Upstate NY, many years ago. The cop says, "No problem," here's the business card of a local lawyer, give him a call. Long story short, the local lawyer told me that he and the "judge" are brothers and the cop is a cousin. He and the judge take turns between prosecuting, judging and private practice. Local lawyer said, just send me some money (forgot the exact sum, as it was a long time ago, but, fairly low, like $125) and don't worry. Never had to go there, got a court receipt for a broken tail light a few weeks later -- not a moving violation, and nothing was broken, of course. Bada-bing, bada-boom...

I did not suggest mailing a letter. If the summons says court appearance is required, you gotta go. The letter was for you to put your arguments in place and present to the prosecutor and maybe the judge so that you don't get nervous and tongue tied and forget a valid point.

I would not bother with a lawyer. The offense will have a maximum of 2 New Jersey points because it is an out of state offense. The lawyer will cost more than the ticket, win or lose.

Formerlyjerseyjack said:
I did not suggest mailing a letter. If the summons says court appearance is required, you gotta go. The letter was for you to put your arguments in place and present to the prosecutor and maybe the judge so that you don't get nervous and tongue tied and forget a valid point.
I would not bother with a lawyer. The offense will have a maximum of 2 New Jersey points because it is an out of state offense. The lawyer will cost more than the ticket, win or lose.

Nobody is suggesting skipping court and getting a warrant. The idea is get s motion in to dismiss prior to the trial.

It's been so long since I've been ticketed- how do 2 points impact insurance

I didn't interpret anyone's comments to mean that he should avoid the summons by staying home and mailing it in. Rather, there has been a change in the local jurisdictional responses to summonses since the N.Y.C., ticket fixing scandal of four years ago. Except for charges like parking tickets, the defendant must appear in order for the summons to be dismissed. The judge has to hear the plea or the excuse, no matter how valid or lame it may be.

Regarding the points, it depends on your insurance company. I purchased a rider that eliminates an experience modification increase for up to 3 points. He should check with his agent. If there is a penalty, it would last two years since one point per year is dropped.

FilmCarp,

Thanks for the help, as well as making me realize the time and money I spent on College and grad school were wasted.

If you would, please send your phone number via private message. The next time I have a concern about a legal issue, I'll call.

Again, thanks.

TomR

RobB said:

Steve said:
You don't have to be a lawyer to be a Justice of the United States Supreme Court, either.

This situation seemed to be...different. I thought maybe they had a magistrate system, then I read this.
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/09/25/nyregion/25courts.html?pagewanted=all

That was a scary read. And 2006 is not too long ago.

ETA: will now be following Freeway's driving advice.

norman said:

RobB said:

Steve said:
You don't have to be a lawyer to be a Justice of the United States Supreme Court, either.

This situation seemed to be...different. I thought maybe they had a magistrate system, then I read this.
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/09/25/nyregion/25courts.html?pagewanted=all

That was a scary read. And 2006 is not too long ago.
ETA: will now be following Freeway's driving advice.

Nothing surprising.

Judicial abuse happens often. Even in large cities like NYC where you think the judges would know better or be under greater supervision.

You can try to fight the abuse. But how many have the money, the time and the resources to go through the cumbersome appeal or judicial complaint process?

What they get away with makes our Bill of Rights into a joke.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/08/03/us/probation-sounding-light-can-land-hard.html

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/08/16/magazine/the-bail-trap.html

I am not a lawyer but my batting average was 70% when arguing my employer's tickets in N.Y. and N.J. motor vehicle courts. My favorite was with the summonses we got every few months in New Paltz municipal court. I made about ten appearances in that court.

The prosecutor would begin his presentation and the judge would see me and then interrupt, "It's o.k., Mr.... . That's the pig farmer. The summons will be dismissed."

I can no longer present in N.Y. state because the bar association pressed to make corporations hire lawyers.

Tom_R said:
FilmCarp,
Thanks for the help, as well as making me realize the time and money I spent on College and grad school were wasted.
If you would, please send your phone number via private message. The next time I have a concern about a legal issue, I'll call.
Again, thanks.
TomR

Is this a way of saying you think that I am mistaken? Or are you saying I should bow to your grad degree? I don't think I was wrong, and I know enough people with grad degrees that they don't really impress me.

Either way, you can pm me with questions anytime.

FilmCarp said:

Tom_R said:
FilmCarp,
Thanks for the help, as well as making me realize the time and money I spent on College and grad school were wasted.
If you would, please send your phone number via private message. The next time I have a concern about a legal issue, I'll call.
Again, thanks.
TomR

Is this a way of saying you think that I am mistaken? Or are you saying I should bow to your grad degree? I don't think I was wrong, and I know enough people with grad degrees that they don't really impress me.
Either way, you can pm me with questions anytime.

I think you guys are talking about different kinds of "guilty"- one moral, one legal. Neither of you are wrong