Does anyone here believe that not impeaching is a good idea? If so I'd like to hear your thoughts.

GL2 said:
Wow, I'm takin' a lickin' here from m/1 and B9. Maybe it's the letter/number combo.

 I still highly respect you because almost always your posts are very spot on.   

I can appreciate that you're frustrated. We're all frustrated.

I don't know if you have kids, but I think of mine all the time, having grown into adults under both Bush/Cheney and now Trump. Both make good money but are strapped with college debt. When I was their age, I had a house and kids. 

Look, we're on the same side here except I (IMO) can work with what we've got, rather than wishing for something else. As i've said before, I equate impeachment with the GOP's repealing ACA 50+ times - satisfying in the short term but ultimately unproductive and possibly empowering to the opposition. 

My desire is to see someone besides Biden lead us. I'm not sure that's gonna happen. If he's the safest bet, and the dems' choice, I must vote for him. 

Anyhoo, I'm off to the great north woods for a while. Ciao.

GL2 said:
I can appreciate that you're frustrated. We're all frustrated.
I don't know if you have kids, but I think of mine all the time, having grown into adults under both Bush/Cheney and now Trump. Both make good money but are strapped with college debt. When I was their age, I had a house and kids. 
Look, we're on the same side here except I (IMO) can work with what we've got, rather than wishing for something else. As i've said before, I equate impeachment with the GOP's repealing ACA 50+ times - satisfying in the short term but ultimately unproductive and possibly empowering to the opposition. 
My desire is to see someone besides Biden lead us. I'm not sure that's gonna happen. If he's the safest bet, and the dems' choice, I must vote for him. 
Anyhoo, I'm off to the great north woods for a while. Ciao.

 The point of the impeachment is not the impeachment. It's the hearings leading up to the  impeachment vote. That is, if they're handled correctly.

But frankly, having seen the performance of the House committees since the Dems took control, I'm not putting a lot of faith in them being effective. The most disappointing thing since the Nov elections is to find out what a weak chair Nadler is. Trump is running circles around him. What a disaster.

Sorry - random post here.

I'm watching this great movie called Captain Fantastic. 

The family at the center of the movie is celebrating Noam Chomsky Day.

Booyah!

(says liberalhollywood to middleamerica)

drummerboy said:
 The point of the impeachment is not the impeachment. It's the hearings leading up to the  impeachment vote. That is, if they're handled correctly.
But frankly, having seen the performance of the House committees since the Dems took control, I'm not putting a lot of faith in them being effective. The most disappointing thing since the Nov elections is to find out what a weak chair Nadler is. Trump is running circles around him. What a disaster.

 I don't know what Nadler can do other than publicly go against Pelosi. Is it time for that? I feel sorry for the guy. Who thought even Hope Hicks would refuse to answer questions as innocuous as where did you sit or perhaps, "On Donny's lap" would have been inappropriate.

His described plan to get such blatant lack of cooperation so that he can put it in front of a judge, is probably all he has left.

Is there something that you think he should do? Subpoena Mueller?

I was a fan of Nadler and couldn't wait for him to gain control but I am frustrated as well.

ETA Well it looks like Nadler as well as Schiff got Mueller to appear July 17.

I have to say I really don't understand the posts essentially saying to take the politics out of impeachment. It's a political process. If people want to make the argument that the political risk to Democrats is low, or that it's a gamble worth making despite the risks, that's one thing, but to argue that this shouldn't be a consideration when considering impeachment makes about as much sense to me as arguing that candidate's shouldn't worry about trying to win run running for office.

Trump needs to leave office. If starting impeachment proceedings makes that more likely, then we should do that. If staring impeachment proceedings makes that unlikely, then we avoid doing it.

My current take is that the investigations are laying the ground for either making impeachment proceedings a better bet or, at the very least, undermining Trump in the 2020 election.

I personally don't think the time has yet arrived to start impeachment proceedings, but it seems plausible to me that within several months the time might arrive.

The Political Costs of Not Impeaching Trump

Or - the political costs of spinelessness 

I’ve resigned myself to believe that Trump is going to be re-elected.  For one, maybe perhaps I will be pleasantly surprised.  Secondly, I’m thinking that maybe a second term won’t be so bad.  Since he won’t ever face reelection, maybe he just won’t show up.  Maybe he’ll just stay in his room all day.  

Red_Barchetta said:
I’ve resigned myself to believe that Trump is going to be re-elected.  For one, maybe perhaps I will be pleasantly surprised.  Secondly, I’m thinking that maybe a second term won’t be so bad.  Since he won’t ever face reelection, maybe he just won’t show up.  Maybe he’ll just stay in his room all day.  

 I do not see the basis for being sure that Trump will be re-elected and I certainly don't see the basis for believing his second term won't be as bad as his first.

To me it is far too early to have any certainty as to the outcome of the Election of 2020.

There's not a chance in hell that Trump will be re-elected.

(Somewhere drummerboy is stirring, ready to remind me of my failed 2016 prognostication, but I'm not about to go 0 for 2.  While Dems can often be clueless moralistic idiots that could screw up a bowl of cornflakes, they're not Hitler-invading-Russia clueless.)