UK Engaged in Large-Scale Secret Propaganda War Against Russia
jamie said:
Beyond RT there are many non-government media sources in Russia that criticize Putin.Paul - just thought I'd re-post this statement of yours - perhaps nan could provide an answer as well.
Please name a couple non-government media sources that criticize Putin that are based in Russia and run by Russians - you said there are many. TIA
Sorry, I missed this. Let's start here (what follows is quoted from the link. The MOL quote function doesn't work with bullets)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Media_of_Russia
Main newspapers
[ . . . ]
- Nezavisimaya Gazeta – pro-opposition privately owned daily
- Novaya Gazeta – daily, known for its investigative journalism
[ . . . ]
- activatica.org
- afterempire.info
- ej.ru
- graniru.org
- kasparov.ru
- meduza.io
- navalny.com
- newtimes.ru
- novayagazeta.ru
- ovdinfo.org
- openmedia.io
- roskomsvoboda.org
- rufabula.com
- rusmonitor.com
- sotnik-tv.com
- theins.ru
- zona.media
ridski said:
https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2014/03/russia-blocks-access-major-independent-news-sites
Wish we could block Gary Kasporov. He's another fake humanitarian neocon.
nan said:
Wish we could block Gary Kasporov. He's another fake humanitarian neocon.
I’m going to assume this is facetious, and not the true sentiment of a strong free-speech advocate.
DaveSchmidt said:
nan said:I’m going to assume this is facetious, and not the true sentiment of a strong free-speech advocate.
Wish we could block Gary Kasporov. He's another fake humanitarian neocon.
Exactly. You can hate Kasparov all you want, but if you value a free press you MUST support him. Any other stance is a akin to signing on to totalitarianism and defiantly supporting Trump.
Paul - that's a pretty lame list. The one that comes close to what I asked is Novaya Gazeta. But looking at their site - I see very little if any Putin critique. I think their investigative reporting is the best I've seen for a Russian newspaper. Chrome has a pretty good translate feature.
It does seem that when thy do report on something they shouldn't, people are threatened or die. So, I think they're a lot more careful in what they report because of this.
If you can find an instance of a recent Putin critique from them - please post.
DaveSchmidt said:
nan said:I’m going to assume this is facetious, and not the true sentiment of a strong free-speech advocate.
Wish we could block Gary Kasporov. He's another fake humanitarian neocon.
She's serious, I think because of something from Jimmy Dore.
I agree, I don't understand the negative comment about Garry Kasparov either.
DaveSchmidt said:
nan said:I’m going to assume this is facetious, and not the true sentiment of a strong free-speech advocate.
Wish we could block Gary Kasporov. He's another fake humanitarian neocon.
Correct.
DaveSchmidt said:
Zona.media is a must-read, if only for the wine recommendations.
Was changed at Ellis Island from Zonawinsky.
can you provide your main takeaway or do you expect everyone to waste an hour of their life ?
jamie said:
can you provide your main takeaway or do you expect everyone to waste an hour of their life ?
Journalists Max Blumenthal and Ben Norton discuss Britain's Integrity Initiative and the information war it is waging on the public, with propaganda expert Professor David Miller. We address the scandal surrounding this UK government-funded think tank, which has attacked Jeremy Corbyn and the anti-war left and laundered disinformation through the corporate media under the guise of countering Russia.
To give a little history on this, in the video and elsewhere the Integrity Initiative is being compared to Project Mockingbird or similar which was exposed in 1977 by Carl Bernstein, writing in Rolling Stone. Journalists were revealed to be working closely with the CIA to push propaganda instead of news. Reading this article from the 1970's and it does not seem like Bernstein's exposure prevented further use of this tactic. The mainstream news is filled with supposedly ex-intelligence personal providing what is supposed to be neutral, fact based stories, which should be reviewed with great skepticism. Anyway, good to read or re-read Bernstein's story because it has not aged at all.
THE CIA AND THE MEDIA
How Americas Most Powerful News Media Worked Hand in Glove with the Central Intelligence Agency and Why the Church Committee Covered It Up
http://www.carlbernstein.com/magazine_cia_and_media.php
jamie said:
ok anything new or just a rehash of what has been reported?
There is lots of detail, discussion and analysis. I'm going to listen to it again and try to take some notes. It would be essential to listen to if you are really following this story. Also, everyone should read the Bernstein article from 1977, because this is very similar with clusters of journalists reporting anti-Russia propaganda as instructed--making the Russians the big bad guys to justify and gain support for heinous crimes like overthrowing Democratically elected governments. I think some of the articles nohero/South_Mout. has posted on Syria were done by people involved in this project. Basically anytime someone gets labeled a "useful idiot for Putin" it's BS, in case you could not figure that out for yourself.
Nan should have attended my 6th grade class, where Mr Itkin taught us about the difference between the news section and opinion section in newspapers. She could have saved 80% of her typing and our reading.
dave said:
Nan should have attended my 6th grade class, where Mr Itkin taught us about the difference between the news section and opinion section in newspapers. She could have saved 80% of her typing and our reading.
I also teach the difference between fact and opinion and the exposure of this operation has, at this point, gone from opinion into fact. You can't use the time honored tactic of calling me a "conspiracy theorist" on this to discourage investigation because the cat is out of the bag. There is also the history of Project Mockingbird, which has been substantiated.
It's the people who think Russia is behind everything that should be wearing the tinfoil hats.
It was amusing for a while, but you don’t need to go any farther than this to find an example of disinformation.
nan said:
nohero/South_Mout.
DaveSchmidt said:
It was amusing for a while, but you don’t need to go any farther than this to find an example of disinformation.
nan said:
nohero/South_Mout.
Really, I thought it was common knowledge that they were the same person. They sound identical and I've never even seen a denial. Also, I can't remember if it was one of them or both that posted about Syria--that's why I put them together. I just chalk it up to one of those quirky MOL things that has some back story I don't know.
nan said:Really, I thought it was common knowledge that they were the same person. They sound identical and I've never even seen a denial. Also, I can't remember if it was one of them or both that posted about Syria--that's why I put them together. I just chalk it up to one of those quirky MOL things that has some back story I don't know.
Where did you get the idea it was common knowledge? Why would either of them owe anyone a denial? What makes them sound identical, beyond the fact that both find fault with your and Paul’s comments? Why perpetuate something “that has some back story I don’t know”?
I think it’s kind of important we ask ourselves questions like these, if we’re to fight disinformation.
DaveSchmidt said:
nan said:Where did you get the idea it was common knowledge? Why would either of them owe anyone a denial? What makes them sound identical, beyond the fact that both find fault with your and Paul’s comments? Why perpetuate something “that has some back story I don’t know”?
Really, I thought it was common knowledge that they were the same person. They sound identical and I've never even seen a denial. Also, I can't remember if it was one of them or both that posted about Syria--that's why I put them together. I just chalk it up to one of those quirky MOL things that has some back story I don't know.
I think it’s kind of important we ask ourselves questions like these, if we’re to fight disinformation.
Don't know where I got the idea--but it is clear as day to me that they are the same person. I'm just not seeing how that is not obvious, like nose on your face obvious. Full disclosure - I know nohero IRL, but I have not talked to him in person for years. So, I don't know what to do with this information, but I won't back down. Perhaps, I should just say "alleged" since I don't have proof. Would that be acceptable to you? Or should I just pretend I think they are two different people? Which would you prefer? I don't want to start an interrogation--I just want to move on, cause I'm interested in fake people in the larger world, not so much on MOL.
Wow - now you're floating conspiracy theories among MOL usernames? ugh - where does it end? LOL
jamie said:
Wow - now you're floating conspiracy theories among MOL usernames? ugh - where does it end? LOL
OK, I guess that is a theory--I will admit that. The threads I've started on Browder and the Integrity Initiative are beyond the theory stage, no matter how you try to frame it.
They have a pretty good twitter feed: https://twitter.com/InitIntegrity
nan said:
Don't know where I got the idea--but it is clear as day to me that they are the same person. I'm just not seeing how that is not obvious, like nose on your face obvious. Full disclosure - I know nohero IRL, but I have not talked to him in person for years. So, I don't know what to do with this information, but I won't back down. Perhaps, I should just say "alleged" since I don't have proof. Would that be acceptable to you? Or should I just pretend I think they are two different people? Which would you prefer? I don't want to start an interrogation--I just want to move on, cause I'm interested in fake people in the larger world, not so much on MOL.
Since you asked, I’d prefer that you kept conspiracy theories about other posters to yourself.
As for fakery in the larger world, the concluding sentence in my previous post was an attempt to be on point.
jamie said:
They have a pretty good twitter feed: https://twitter.com/InitIntegrity
Yes, and that is filled with propaganda. That's where they make the propaganda sausage. Anything you read on that page should be scrutinized deeply.
Edited to add: I've been re-listening to the Grayzone video and this is what Ben Norton said about the Integrity Initiative twitter feed:
Yes, before the Corbyn media reports on this scandal were published, two weeks before, I had tweeted about a lot of this information. It was pretty straightforward. When I found out that the Integrity Initiative was British gov funded, when that was disclosed and I went back and they were retweeting all of these Syria regime change trolls. A lot of the trolls that had been attacking us for years now. They had been amplified by the British funded organization.
So, I just went through it’s Twitter feed and I saw - this is late November, November 26th that they had in the last few days retweeted Alexander Reid Roth -- a fraud and They retweeted libel-ish tweets that were all retracted from the . . .accusing anyone on the anti-war left and accusing them of secretly being in alliance with the far-right for opposing war. The Integrity Initiative is also retweeting Pat Hilsman, another ostensibly left-wing supporter of regime change in Syria. Also, retweeting Oz Katerji, another alt-centrist troll who has basically attacked Jeremy Corbyn, yelling at him that he he is complicit in genocide.
jamie said:
Wow - now you're floating conspiracy theories among MOL usernames? ugh - where does it end? LOL
Much less far-fetched than the conspiracy theory that the Trump campaign colluded with the Russian government to influence the 2016 election.
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Jaime, on other threads you have criticized and banned me for supposedly hijacking the thread. But, here you are in a thread about a UK psyop demanding that Paul and I give you a list of Russian media outlets that criticize Putin. How is this relevant to the Integrity Initiative?