nohero said:

This:

 This Samantha Power quote is precisely the essence of the last 3 years: how TF are we to believe anything out of this administration?

Can we please curse out Bush/Cheney at least once more before we move on.

And of course the rest of Planet Earth blames us for f'ing up the Paris Accord, as opposed to the Honda Accord, which is a very reliable sedan.

Tim Kaine introduced a War Powers resolution to require congressional approval for military action against Iran.

https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/476702-kaine-introduces-resolution-to-block-war-with-iran

Trump has actively denied the accuracy of reports of Russian interference in the United States elections by the intelligence community. But in this case apparently they were right about an imminent attack.

Is there anyone in Trump's audience that is so stupid that they think that killing Soleimani will actually have any effect on any attacks that were planned?

rhetorical question

drummerboy said:

Is there anyone in Trump's audience that is so stupid that they think that killing Soleimani will actually have any effect on any attacks that were planned?

rhetorical question

 Is there anyone so stupid to think that Soleimani’s death will have any effect on multiple attacks which took place worldwide over two decades? 

As far as future attacks, perhaps the death of the second man in the car with Soleimani, reportedly his second in command, might derail any planned attacks. 

U.S intelligence has identified threats to US citizens and soldiers and taken action to foil them, often without headlines, sometimes with. Special Forces and drones are in a constant state of disrupting plans.

What was the difference with this intelligence about a threat that made assassinating a general within another different country's airspace the best action?

If the general was not going to personally carry out the action, this termination will not have stopped it.

The decision was either bad or had another motive. With this administration, I can't say which.

mtierney said:

drummerboy said:

Is there anyone in Trump's audience that is so stupid that they think that killing Soleimani will actually have any effect on any attacks that were planned?

rhetorical question

 Is there anyone so stupid to think that Soleimani’s death will have any effect on multiple attacks which took place worldwide over two decades? 

As far as future attacks, perhaps the death of the second man in the car with Soleimani, reportedly his second in command, might derail any planned attacks. 

If he was as brilliant as he apparently was, it's really unlikely that any planned attack would be derailed by the death of one guy, particularly him.

mtierney said:

As far as future attacks, perhaps the death of the second man in the car with Soleimani, reportedly his second in command, might derail any planned attacks. 

If you’re referring to Naim Qassem, he was second in command of Hezbollah, not Soleimani’s Quds Force.

And I really think it's hilarious that Suleimani is being described as the number one evil man on the planet, and 99.99% of America had never heard of the guy before.

We are a gullible and stupid people.

mtierney said:

drummerboy said:

Is there anyone in Trump's audience that is so stupid that they think that killing Soleimani will actually have any effect on any attacks that were planned?

rhetorical question

 Is there anyone so stupid to think that Soleimani’s death will have any effect on multiple attacks which took place worldwide over two decades? 

As far as future attacks, perhaps the death of the second man in the car with Soleimani, reportedly his second in command, might derail any planned attacks. 

 Is there anyone so stupid as to think Trump has not committed any other foreign policy blunder more dangerous?

meanwhile, in FoxNews land

Fox's Pete Hegseth: "Maybe your second general is next if you continue to try to kill Americans. We are the top dog. You respond to us, not the other way around." Stuart Varney: "Bring the fire, Hegseth!" Hegseth: "I’m fired up. Because the president brought the fire!" pic.twitter.com/bsdBT4rAPn

— Justin Baragona (@justinbaragona) January 3, 2020

here's a transcript of  a State Dept press conference, in which they supply absolutely no evidence of any kind of imminent  threat.

https://www.state.gov/senior-state-department-officials-on-the-situation-in-iraq/

drummerboy said:

mtierney said:

drummerboy said:

Is there anyone in Trump's audience that is so stupid that they think that killing Soleimani will actually have any effect on any attacks that were planned?

rhetorical question

 Is there anyone so stupid to think that Soleimani’s death will have any effect on multiple attacks which took place worldwide over two decades? 

As far as future attacks, perhaps the death of the second man in the car with Soleimani, reportedly his second in command, might derail any planned attacks. 

If he was as brilliant as he apparently was, it's really unlikely that any planned attack would be derailed by the death of one guy, particularly him.

Every six months, for years, we are treated with how our government killed some top Al-Qaeda, ISIS, Hezbollah guy, etc. All these victories. All this winning.

But have we seen improvement in the Middle East? I think not. Look at Syria, Iraq, Afghanistan. Where are the flowers our leaders told us they would throw at our feet when we gifted them with our gift of Democracy? 

The reality is the populace despises us.

And Americans go without affordable health care or any.

PVW said:

 A fair bit longer than that -- I'm not sure I can point to a single moment from European contact through today that the US or its colonial predecessors could not be characterized as militantly expansionist.

 another aspect of this that generally goes unremarked upon is that our elected leaders are carrying out the will of most of the population.  The proportion of our people who are against war except in very extreme circumstances to defend ourselves is pretty small.  To solely blame Bush or Obama or even Trump for lying us into wars or committing extra-Constitutional acts of war is to let ourselves as a country off the hook.  Collectively, we WANT these wars.  We've been indoctrinated to believe that we're doing these things to "save" the world, to protect "freedom", to defeat the "evildoers."  Even on supposedly "leftist" MOL, how many of us have expressed opposition to all of our military incursions over the past 15 or so years?  I guess it's maybe a half dozen of us over the years.  There were an awful lot of people who hated Bush's invasion of Iraq, but were willing to believe invading Libya or fighting in Yemen was "right."  The fault lies not in our stars, but in ourselves.

Look at who’s on MSNBC

Thank you, paulsurovell, I for one applaud you demonstrating against this action.

And cool that it was covered on the oft maligned MSNBC!

good thread on the "evidence" that justified the Suleimani attack

1. I’ve had a chance to check in with sources, including two US officials who had intelligence briefings after the strike on Suleimani. Here is what I’ve learned. According to them, the evidence suggesting there was to be an imminent attack on American targets is “razor thin”.

— Rukmini Callimachi (@rcallimachi) January 4, 2020

The threat of War is a serious problem but so is the fact that Trump has absolutely no credibility so even if there is an actual threat in the future or an actual justification for any action by him he will not be believed.

Meanwhile, Trump is literally threatening to do war crimes.

Pompeo is on the Sunday morning - Attack on Soleimani - Justification Tour.  One thing that I think is clear is that they have no clear evidence of a true imminent threat.  And if they do have something substantial - they better let congress know what the facts were.  And how the imminent threat this week, was any different then it was last week.

This is insane - there should be another article of impeachment drawn up immediately.

jamie said:

...

This is insane - there should be another article of impeachment drawn up immediately.

 Getting impeached for killing our worstest enemy on the planet will not sell well among the masses.

drummerboy said:

jamie said:

...

This is insane - there should be another article of impeachment drawn up immediately.

 Getting impeached for killing our worstest enemy on the planet will not sell well among the masses.

 Point taken.  

STANV said:

Yesterday trump said he was against War, but today:

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/02/world/middleeast/qassem-soleimani-iraq-iran-attack.html

Everyone is for peace.

Leaders talking of their love of peace and hate of war are usually the ones to be watched.

We want this people to be 
        obedient and you must practice this 
        obedience; we want this people to be 
        peace-loving but also brave and you must 
        be peace-loving! You must therefore be peace-loving ...
        

hmmm. deciding to quit the Pentagon now is...revealing.

Fifth Pentagon official announces resignation in seven days https://t.co/vwEQWAROhb

— John M. Talmadge, MD (@JohnMTalmadgeMD) January 5, 2020

"Dear Colleague" from Speaker Pelosi:

As Members of Congress, our first responsibility is to keep the American people safe. For this reason, we are concerned that the Administration took this action without the consultation of Congress and without respect for Congress’s war powers granted to it by the Constitution.

This week, the House will introduce and vote on a War Powers Resolution to limit the President’s military actions regarding Iran. This resolution is similar to the resolution introduced by Senator Tim Kaine in the Senate. It reasserts Congress’s long-established oversight responsibilities by mandating that if no further Congressional action is taken, the Administration’s military hostilities with regard to Iran cease within 30 days.

The House Resolution will be led by Congresswoman Elissa Slotkin. Congresswoman Slotkin is a former CIA and Department of Defense analyst specializing in Shia militias. She served multiple tours in the region under both Democratic and Republican Administrations.

Every time I read the title I hear this song.